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This archive is not for profit

Jul 07, 2011

Due to recent developments in (Lord of the Rings) fan fiction, we thought it might be good to point out that this site is non-profit.

We are not making any money from this site (notice the lack of advertising), in fact, it costs us money, and most of all, lots and lots of time. But we’re happy with that, because we love Faramir fiction: we love the stories and the pictures, we love the authors the artists, and we love anyone who visits and leaves comments — everyone who makes the site what it is.
If there should ever come a time that we don’t love it any more, and we can’t find anyone else to do that labour of love (and pay the bills) in our stead, this site will simply (and sadly) disappear, rather than be sold to the highest bidder.

All stories and artwork that are archived at this site, are posted either by the authors or artists themselves, or with their permission. While many others believe that once you’ve shared your fan fiction or fan art, it’s free for anyone to do with as they wish, we very firmly feel that it should be up to the author/artist to decide in which context her work is displayed, and that permission to archive work is therefore limited to this site and these conditions.
For that reason, we always stress that if you want to redistribute or repost work you have found here, you have to get permission from the author/artist first. For the same reason, we would never assume that permission given under one set of circumstances would automatically apply to another set or circumstances too.

Therefore we promise this site will be non-profit throughout its lifetime.

Yours,
Minx & Iris


11 Comment(s)

Dear Minx, dear Iris,

many things have been said about this issue during the past days and I´m afraid there´s hardly anything helpful I could add. Just so much: I´m glad you took the time to post this, not because anyone would doubt your integrity – I`m sure nobody does – but because it´s good to know this matter spreads out and people are aware of it.

From a certain point of view what happens is almost amazing. My own fandom history started about two years ago (means I didn´t witness the fail of FanLib) and when I heard about it first I went “Oh no, now even a place like this is in the clutches of global capitalism!” I had never dared to expect such a powerful backlash. The dedication of the people who spread the news, the solidarity among the most different fandoms – it´s like poking a snake and suddenly the Midgard Serpent raises its pate. Obviously Mr. M. hasn´t expected it either – by now he hasn´t released any more statements, neither on his blog nor on lotrfanfiction.

Again, I´d like to say thanks to you both. I think you do a great and responsible job and it´s good to have people like you around!

raven22372    7 July 2011, 20:32    #

I cannot begin to express my gratitude and appreciation for the amount of work you are devoting to this archive. I love it to pieces and should you ever need a donation, I’d happily contribute. I trust you completely – which is one of the reasons I post here. This profit-seeking business I find disgusting, and you, Minx and Iris, all the more honourable for not touching it.
Thank you.

Geale    7 July 2011, 20:45    #

Raven22372, Geale – you’re very sweet, both of you! Thank you very much for your words of encouragement.

Everybody has their own choices to make, and I’m not berating anyone for their choices, I just want to make FaramirFiction’s stance clear. This isn’t anything new, the non-profit thing has always been in our Disclaimer & Credits — but I don’t think anyone has ever read those. To me it’s always been self-evident that you don’t profit from fan fiction – that seemed something so obvious that it didn’t occur to me it was something that needed to be publicly proclaimed.
But then again it has always been self-evident to me too that you don’t repost fics without permission, or distribute them once the author has chosen to withdraw them — and, to my utter surprise, I recently found out that’s not a value shared by everyone. So sometimes it’s good to state the obvious, because it might not be obvious to everyone.

Iris    7 July 2011, 21:18    #

Simply: Thank you very much.

elektra121    7 July 2011, 22:03    #

I’d just like to echo what has already been said by thanking you both for your dedication and hard work and genuine love for this site and your unwavering integrity; I’m still fairly a ‘newcomer’ to the fandom (though I think I’ve been here for almost a year now!) and otherwise don’t really participate in any LJ communities or fanfic sites (other than fanfiction.net, which to be brutally honest, I hate) because I’m shy and because this wonderful site is a well-run, honest and friendly haven where everyone I’ve come into contact with has been simply lovely and so welcoming.
I did read up on the situation over on Esteliel’s journal a few days ago, and it is indeed rather sad and shocking that someone could think to profit from something that, inherently, should not (and cannot) be used for profit. I of course know that the upkeep of a website doesn’t happen for free, and I can only thank you both profusely for your continued dedication to keeping this site as a place to enjoy stories without the legalities and grey-areas that a for-profit situation would bring. That said, like Geale, I would happily make a contribution if you should ever open up for donations.

Thank you again both of you; this site really is a rare sanctuary and your hard-work and love is clear in all that can be seen here :)

Eora    8 July 2011, 22:04    #

Elektra121 — thank *you*!

Eora — glad to have you aboard!
To be honest, I wasn’t very shocked at all that someone would want to make money with fan fiction. I don’t think that’s a new phenomenon. Just look at the sites you mention: fanfiction.net is ad supported (I don’t know how much income that generates (ie, just enough to cover costs, or enough to turn a profit); I couldn’t be asked to read through all of their TOS since they’re in that American brand of legalese — which doesn’t come cheap so that in itself is a sign there’s a professional outfit running that site), and LiveJournal is shamelessly commercial, charging for the silliest little things and with ads everywhere if you don’t pay to have them removed and don’t have the wits to install an adblocker.
And yet, people have LJ accounts (I have!) and some even pay for them (I don’t!). As a blogging site, LJ is rubbish, there are far better services out there. But we go there because of the user generated content, so in effect, they’re making money (or trying to make money) off fan fiction. And everybody seems to be ok with that.

So I think it’s not so much the commercialism, but rather the change in conditions that has people upset. Everybody knows LJ is in it for the money when they sign up and post their fics there. But the sudden change from a non-profit to a profit site, without consultation or notice, is what has people protesting.
I think. I don’t know. I just know that’s not going to happen here.

Iris    9 July 2011, 12:05    #

I am ashamed to say that I’ve heard of none of this before. The whole concept of some person/company profiting from works of fanfiction with their knowledge (Fanlib) is bad enough. For the owner of a site to sell it and thus everything on it to someone planning to profit for it is a sad thing. In order for your work not to be used, you have to make a/n (possibly large) effort to remove it and post elsewhere. What happens if the site won’t let you remove your own work?
I can only wonder how the legals of this are going to work.

— Bell Witch    16 July 2011, 07:35    #

Bell Witch – all I can say is that that won’t happen here. At FaramirFiction.com we only every archive material with the author/artist’s permission. We feel very strongly that the author/artist should always retain control over what happens with her work. From this standpoint, it logically follows that the author/artist always has the right to remove her work – of course we don’t want that to happen, but we would never go against the author/artist’s wishes.
I always thought that everybody I knew in fanfic believed that, and that those who think you can do as you wish with other people’s stories were, well other people: the types (usually teenagers who have never written anything in their life) that inhabit the shadowy underworld of fan fiction such as sites devoted to trashing and mocking stories, or swapping stories that were removed by the author (yes, those sites exist & they’re horrid!). But then recently I found out that some people quite close to this archive also thought there was nothing morally wrong with exchanging stories that the author doesn’t want to share any more, which I found very shocking and prompted us to do a post on site rules. (The other type of people in fanfic I don’t like are those who spend more time writing rules than writing stories, and get more pleasure out of administrating and ‘ruling over’ their domain than they get from the fan fic themselves, and all this makes me feel like I’m being forced into becoming one of them — so double horror there.)

They cited copyright rules as justification for distributing stories against the author's wishes: because fanfic's legal status is dubious, the author has no copyright, and therefore the stories are owned by the public domain.

They're probably right, but only if the question is, 'will I get sued for posting stories against the author's wishes?' I for one like to hold myself to a higher standard than merely avoiding prosecution, and treat others as I'd like to be treated myself. I want to have control over where my stories are and aren't posted, therefore I'd never limit the control others have over their stories. Simple, right?

Iris    25 July 2011, 07:59    #

Did my stories get removed from this site and i didn’t know? I saw only two stories, and i know that i have more than that.

No, none of your stories have been removed. Your stories are listed at www.faramirfiction.com/authors/sivan-shemesh - I count 10 stories there. If you don't see all ten, you probably have the adult content filter on (see the right-hand menu, under Filter).
If you have any questions, you can always reach us at admin@faramirfiction.com.
- the archivists

Maybe i just need to add more stories to this site as well as i’m doing with AO3 as i am moving my stories from other site that started the profit as buy it from the owner, not mention the name of the site.

— Sivan Shemesh    29 October 2011, 00:41    #

I have been not on-line for a full year due my eyes and all. When I came back…many sites had vanished or had changed ownership to people who want to make profit from the people and their writings. Those new owners saw how many love Fanfiction. one of the examples of late that made me really aware of this has been Lotrfanfiction.
I am glad that you think so and that you all make yourself so much work to keep the site as it is. This is one of the few that is still the way it was before.
Thank you^^

Suryallee    8 January 2012, 12:55    #

@suryallee—

Running an archive like this one costs both time and money. You can’t simply pay for the domain name and hosting for the next 10 years and leave the site to run itself: it needs constant maintenance and attention, or else you’ll get lots of spam and bitchy comments leading to irritated authors, and ultimately to authors withdrawing their work.
When Minx and I started this site nearly 8 years ago, I don’t think either of us expected it to still be running in 2012. Most people simply don’t stick to one fandom for that long, but move on to other subjects or abandon fan fiction altogether. So I really don’t blame any other site owners for losing interest or motivation: that is only natural.

And once you’ve decided you’re not going to invest your time and money in a site any longer, you can either hand it over into someone else’s care, or pull the plug altogether. I can very well understand that someone would find that first option the most desirable, after all, many hours went into creating the site, and it’d be a shame to destroy that. I suspect that when the time comes for me to make that choice about this site, there will be people who’d rather see it continue (albeit supported by advertising) than disappear altogether.

Iris    9 January 2012, 14:05    #

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